tv Morning Joe MSNBC December 6, 2011 6:00am-9:00am EST
montana. i'm up at 3:30 because my new tatoo hurts. >> any chance we could see that tatoo? see what he's got. >> it's kind of -- >> really. that's not really it, is it? a mix tag? he didn't even go back to a cd. he went all the way back to a mix tape. rocking it from 1988. i love it. good luck with that. there is tatoo removal available just so you know. one more for you. from at mitchell reports. reported to be one andrea mitchell. watching live in israel on hot cable. our new msnbc tv partner. how about that? we are on in israel now. i understand phil griffin the president of msnbc is watching as well. phil, i want a raise. "morning joe" starts right now. good morning, israel! ♪ some people say the america we know and love is a thing of
the past. i don't believe that. because working together, i know we can rebuild america. we can revive our economy and create jobs, shrink government and the regulations that strangle our businesses. throw out the tax code and replace it with one that is simple and fair. >> what's up with these sorry politicians? lots of bark. when it's show time wimpering like little shih tzus. you want big cuts? ron paul has been saying it for years. no problem. the department of education? gone. interior, energy, hud, commerce, gone. that's how ron paul rolls. want to drain the swamp? ron paul. do it. >> i'm ron paul and i approve this message. >> that would be a contrast. is that a contrast? >> that is a contrast. wow. >> in a big way. good morning everyone. live look at times square so
early in the morning. it's tuesday, december 6th. welcome to "morning joe." >> mark halperin was crying. >> look at the tear in his eye. >> that moved you. it moves you. >> morning in america. >> boy. it is morning in america. >> msnbc and "time" magazine senior political analyst mark halperin and visiting professor at nyu, former democratic congressman harold ford jr. >> what do you think of these commercials, mika? what do you think? the first was newt. >> we have a lot of newt coverage in the news. i'm going to stay objective. >> yeah. so what about the ron paul commercial? >> i'm going to abstain from opinion. >> were they able to get our friend from boston to do that ron paul commercial? >> that was a dennis leary chevy type ad. >> i would also suggest ron paul does a lot of things. i don't think he rolls by definition. they said that's the way ron paul rolls. i don't think ron paul rolls. >> you watch that guy though. he's rolling up to 20%.
>> yes, he is. >> yes. donald trump is in the news. >> yes, he is. >> pertaining to politics as well. >> my goodness. >> we'll to that. and also unrest with -- >> newt met with donald, right? >> there is that and there is the debate. >> and ron paul dissed newt. what did he say exactly? >> very personal. >> about donald? >> no, about newt. about what he should do in new york. mentioned wives. >> tiffany's. no denot. >> yes, he did. >> why is he doing that? >> that's how he rolls. >> that's how he rolls. that's kind of strange. wrote an op-ed. one of the most back-handed compliments i've ever given. >> you have to read all the way to the end to get the surprise twist. >> you get about 90% of the way through it and you're like this is an endorsement? anyway. but he does -- he's got, you know, he is a mess and we attack him. we -- really badly -- but the
bottom line is for a year, balanced budget, welfare reform, some pretty fascinating things. that's why people who don't know newt, conservatives who don't know newt like newt. >> well, maybe that explains some of the polls we're seeing. the gingrich campaign is ramping up its efforts right now in iowa as new polling there shows the former house speaker with a sizable lead in the early caucus state with less than a month to go if you can believe it before voting there. >> holy cow. >> can you believe it? it's common. >> are you serious? >> we're going to be there. abc news and "the washington post" poll shows gingrich with 33% support of likely republican caucus goers. that's 15 points ahead of mitt romney and ron paul who were tied for second. >> my gosh. >> the obama re-election team -- >> let's just soak these numbers in. by the way, we're talking the michele bachmann later. harold ford, 33%. timing is everything.
>> meteoric rise here at the end. i think you all have touched on these points. you've touched on these points over the last few days and your op-ed does as well. he has -- he's been around so long that a lot of the negatives on him are out there. the narrative is established. but people in the republican party, particularly those in the republican -- who are going to participate in the republican caucus, are anxious for a real conservative in their mind who will stand up to obama, stand up to democrats, and, you know, he is politically and intellectual li intellectually ambidextrous. mitt romney as halperin has said for sometime has not been able to connect and resonate and hold on to more than -- >> you mean unfortunately for mitt romney. >> put aside my -- >> no, no. >> unfortunately for mitt. >> exactly. >> and gingrich is the toughest opponent he has faced. he is the toughest opponent he's
faced so far, mitt -- of the palin, bachmann, trump, cain -- because newt, again, whether you agree with him or not and i think your column points out a lot of relevant points, he has a record. he's been part of balancing budgets, part of welfare reform, part of making a strong case for the country about seven or eight changes congress will make, and he was able to deliver on some of this in the eyes of voters. >> mark, what is fascinating about gingrich is you look at his voting record. his conservative is -- his acu rating is not as high as mine but very few people are. he's 95% acu. but you look at what happened when he wasn't in charge of congress for those two years. he's had four but for the two that he was doing well, his life has been a train wreck. politically he's been a train
wreck. the words that he -- that have come from his mouth, the things that he has done would have destroyed him and any other candidate any other year but 2012. but this wheat field is producing the possibility of a new newt gingrich nomination. >> i saw him in new york in the middle of the day. he is extraordinarily confident right now. >> oh, yes. >> and, you know, every nominee of both parties who has ever been nominated has faced a scare, something where it looks like you're dead. romney looked like he might get through the nomination without facing it. he's facing it now. >> that's why the obama re-election team is taking note not just of mitt romney which they have been doing of late but of the gingrich surge. the president's chief campaign adviser david axelrod took a jab at the republican contender's latest ad. >> i was amused by the newt gingrich ad, by the way, because
he talked about he's going to bring the country together to solve problems. you talk about the godfather of gridlock here, the guy who, you know, two decades ago really invented the kind of tactics that have now become commonplace in washington so this is a whole new newt. >> we heard it here first, the obama case against newt? >> i think it may be the public's case against him. i don't think people want to go back to that. >> do they want to go back to that? >> go back to what? no one remembers. that was 20 years ago. most voters don't have a recollection of that. >> but the thing is if you ask republicans, do you want to go back to a time where against all odds, and again, i am not supporting newt. i am not going to vote for newt. i will not support him in any way. if you've been watching my show in the past two weeks and you think there is any ambiguity then you aren't the sharpest tool in the shed. that said if i'm republican in south carolina and i don't know just how erratic and undisciplined newt gingrich is
and what a danger to america he would be, i would sit there and think. okay. here is a guy -- >> south carolina. >> look at south carolina. there you go. here is a guy, newt gingrich, who faced down bill clinton in 1994, came in, gave republicans a first majority in a generation. harold, this is a couple years before you ran. >> right. >> nobody believed gingrich could do it. everybody was making fun of gingrich in '93-'94. i remember when i went up to washington and went into the rnc and they said think majority. me. the republican's republican. at that time believing if republicans would just get in everything would be fine. i saw "think majority" and i laughed. i said oh, come on. listen. if we can cut it in half that'll be great. but gingrich masterminded a takeover, first in a generation. within a year we balanced the budget or had a balanced budget amendment and within three years balanced the budget for the first time in a generation four years in a row for the first
time since the 1920s passed welfare reform. and, of course, i don't care that everybody now is saying bill clinton did this because of bill clinton. no. >> he played a role. >> i'm saying he played a role but i'm saying though newt gingrich dragged him to the table. >> wouldn't have happened. >> it wouldn't have happened without newt. and this is important. historically for people to understand today, that bill clinton, because his base told him to, he vetoed welfare reform twice and we just kept sending it back. i remember newt just saying we're just going to keep sending it to him and hopefully he'll veto it nine times and the tenth he'll have to sign it. so newt was right there. on balancing the budget. balancing the budget. yes, the government was shut down. but guess what? it dragged him to the table and the budget was balanced for the first time in a generation. all i'm explaining here is why republican voters across america that haven't seen the train wreck that has been newt gingrich's political career and life would say, you know what?
i'm going to vote for him instead of mitt romney. >> it's not hard to find the train wreck. it's really not that hard. >> but it's hard -- george w. bush was president and he had a republican congress. he didn't pass anything as massive as welfare reform. >> right. >> he didn't balance the budget. it's very hard to belittle or minimize the important of bill clinton in this process. >> i'm not belittling it. but the reality is bill clinton did not -- >> he stood up -- i was in congress and he pulled us moderate democrats with him and put a coalition of democrats and republicans together. i think that model is one that should be mimicked even today. >> we sent him the same bill for welfare reform three times. he finally signed it on the balanced budget. denot want to do it because his base did not want to do it. guess what? it ended up balancing the budget. >> clinton won on that as well. democrats got their concessions. i don't deny gingrich's successes. >> we balanced the budget.
that's all we cared about. but gist want to say, again, my point here is after trashing newt gingrich for a month, i am trying to explain why conservatives would say, this guy did something. guess what? mark, you were there reporting on it. not only did newt gingrich do something, he did something historic. he did something that hadn't been done in 40 years. and it was ugly. and i didn't even like newt when he was doing it. he was just sort of this irascible guy. >> he could become the republican nomee and could become the president. he could. he has a new wife and he's converted to catholicism and he is a grandfather. do you hold open the possibility that he could be a changed man and a different man than the one you think would be danger synonomous. >> i'm going to answer that because no. i wrote a column about him six months ago and it was all about what newt was saying, what comes out of his mind. he called kathleen sebelius who
is a very nice lady, called her bland on politico. she's not bland. she is a nice lady. you can disagree with her. he compared her to joseph stalin just this year. he said the democratic party was what did he call it, a socialist, secular machine that poses a greater threat to america than nazism? no. he called the cbo a socialist scheme basically to take down america. no. he is not a nice human being. he is a bad person when it comes to demonizing opponents. as george will said, he would have made a marvelous marxist because he dehumanizes anybody that gets in his way. >> okay. so i have a question for you and then we've got to get to -- >> i want to make sure. is that fair? i'm not talking about the conclusions but just over the past six months he has said some horrific things about people with families, with children. he is a -- when he puts on his political helmet he is a terrible person. he dehumanizes people like glenn
beck. >> he says things -- >> calling them racist, bigots, marxists. >> he does say those things but i am not willing to say he is a bad person. >> no, politically. he may be a nice person at home. >> he practices his politics to joe's point. there is a demonization component. >> it's nasty. >> and not in that ad though. occasionally he talks about unifying the country. >> that's not even an argument. >> he is a strange -- you're wasting time debating that and if you guys don't see it i can't help you. >> no, no. people that don't know newt at home need to know this. >> okay. >> by the way, you sit here and you breathe this and live this 24 hours a day and i've known him for 20 years. there are a lot of people out there that don't. and as you -- i think we're trying to be fair here. yes, i'm saying that politically the politico persona, newt is a bad person. he dehumanizes people. but i'm also explaining why conservatives, willie, if you're conservative in south carolina, and you're looking at these republicans that don't seem to
be able to shoot straight, you know, 20 years ago he led a revolution to balance the budget. >> it also tells you something about where the primary voters are. when you look at the polls in iowa, south carolina, new hampshire, that that's what they want to hear. they want to hear fighter. mitt romney leaves them a little limp but newt gingrich is going out on the stump every day and they want president obama out. >> we need to have a national conversation about this because the republican party is on the press mi edge in a little over a month of telling the country these are your two choices. >> the republicans need to have a national conversation about it. >> yes they do. >> the people elected in 1994. has any republican in that class endorsed newt gingrich? i was told that has not taken place. >> greg gansky is his iowa chairman. >> he was elected in '94? >> i will tell you -- >> they probably know him best. >> my conservative friends that -- the 15 or so of us that pushed newt -- i talked about pushing clinton -- we had to push newt because he wanted to cave in.
those of us who told newt, if you don't fight for a balanced budget and don't fight for these tax cuts and don't fight for the cuts in committee chairmanships, etcetera, etcetera, that we promised we were going to do, we are going to kick you out, those 10 or 15 or so, every one of them -- tom coburn, matt salmon running again in arizona, all of them -- they may not be saying it publicly but privately they're sending me e-mails every day going, what -- what -- how -- how many times does newt have to teach these people he's bad for the conservative movement? so there's -- i've got to say i don't believe, mika, there was something in politico that said people were holding the fire against newt because they were -- they were thinking they might have to make peace with him if he won the nomination. let me tell you something. the republican establishment will never make peace with newt gingrich. they just won't. >> but if they spoke out -- >> what i'm saying, they won't.
this is an important point. because the republicans i talked to say, he cannot win the nomination at any cost. he will destroy our party. he will re-elect barack obama and we'll be ruined. >> well -- >> that's going to happen. >> that was the question i was trying to ask about five minutes ago before i was trying to get to the donald trump story and that is which of those candidates could beat obama? mitt romney or newt gingrich? because that's the bottom line, whether or not americans want to look back at the train wreck of his political history or not. they do want to be pragmatic, the base at least, and figure out who can win. who can win? i think, mika, at this point there are a lot of smart people and there are a lot of people with a lot of money that are saying, how do we open this back up? because the choice between mitt romney and newt gingrich for the people that run the republican party is not good enough. and we're hearing people going back going, do we -- how do we
broker a convention? how do we -- and, mark, i'm sure you're hearing the same thing. they're saying that we've got to have another bite of the apple. whether it's -- whether it's jeb or kris christie. this is not wishful thinking. the republican establishment is saying, right now, this cannot happen. he will destroy the party and lose -- >> the question is i think people will increasingly speak out against gingrich. i'm not sure it'll hurt gingrich in the next month. >> so newt gingrich spent monday in new york city visiting real estate mogul donald trump. speaking to reporters after the meeting gingrich defended trump against attacks from ron paul who says trump, moderating a debate, would create a, quote, circus atmosphere. gingrich is one of four republican presidential hopefuls who have agreed to participate in trump's debate later this month. >> i'm actually very surprised that one of my friends would have said that.
this is a country which elected a peanut farmer to the presidency. it elected an actor who had made two movies with a chimpanzee to the presidency. this is a country with enormously wide open talent. you know, donald trump is a great showman. he's also a great businessman. if we're trying to figure out how to create jobs, i think one of the differences between my party and the other party is we actually go to people who know how to create jobs. >> i want to ask willie quickly, you look at that and you look at everything that's going on out there and i have to ask you, the takeaway question, can we -- do we have a freeze of that or can we show the v.o. of that press conference again? the question is, willie, have you seen in all of these get togethers with donald trump, have you seen donald look iing >> he goes to florida. >> he's been golfing. >> look how good he looks. look at him. >> can we freeze that? >> eye candy.
>> he is eye candy. >> scathing statement. >> can we freeze -- i want to put that on a bumper shot. just of donald looking, that palm beach tan. >> gingrich said he made the trip because he likes being in new york around christmas time. ron paul's campaign -- >> you know, actually trump tower is next door. it's seriously next door to tiffany's so of course he loves that. it is. it is right next to tiffany's for those of you who haven't been to new york you've got trump tower and right next door is where audrey hepburn had that opening scene in "breakfast at tiffany's." >> in a scathing statement -- >> you should call newt. >> i know. apparently he has quite a line there. ron paul says this. while those of us in the paul camp might disagree with newt gingrich about whether donald trump is the right man to host a serious political debate we do agree new york is a wonderful place to go at christmas. we are sure two average americans like speaker gingrich and donald trump will have a wonderful time picking out gifts
for their wives. we suggest a place called tiffany's. we hear it's quite a nice -- quite nice this time of year, and given their celebrity status they can probably get special deals and $500,000 lines of credit. >> you know, mika, i was surprised by this tiffany story before. >> yes. >> how much money that was. >> i didn't. >> i was thinking, who can, other than moguls, who can afford to blow that kind of money. >> at tiffany's. >> they give you that line of credit. >> exactly. i sat there thinking, gingrich couldn't make -- what is he -- i'm thinking is he making two, $3 million a year? and i -- >> no. >> and then we find out he's made $100 million. >> that is a lot of money. >> in that revolving door in washington. willie, that is a lot of money. >> that's called cashing in. >> he said he was here for christmas. let's be clear. he was here to raise money yesterday at lunch, dinner, mark, you were following him around. the question is can he raise
enough cash quickly enough to keep up with his rise in the polls to carry him through iowa, new hampshire, into south carolina. >> remember, pat buchanan won the new hampshire primary with very little money and no organization. mike huckabee. he had the churches. but i think gingrich right now, romney has to stop him. he can't rely on other people to do it. >> right now i would say gingrich doesn't make the long track because when you turn into the midwest, when you go the northeast, that's when it gets tougher. but that said, he could destroy mitt romney's campaign. >> if he wins iowa, south carolina, florida, he doesn't need the midwest. >> does this hurt obama, joe? >> what? >> if you're sitting in the white house right now watching the romney/gingrich fight are you encouraged? >> they absolutely love it. i mean, newt gingrich would possibly win a hundred electoral votes. it will be maybe -- if newt gingrich wins the general -- i mean, wins the primary, ohio is out of play. pennsylvania is out of play. michigan is out of play. wisconsin is out of play. minnesota is out of play. florida is out of play.
virginia is out of play. his home state out of play. all the swing states are out of play. this will be a rout. even for a president who in my opinion, barack obama, has failed on just about every front. it would -- it's systemic. >> gingrich brings in a third candidate, could kill -- >> no doubt. >> coming up -- >> can i clean up one thing quickly? >> yes you may. >> i was very careful in my newspaper column to say i don't know newt gingrich personally. there are a lot of people that blog about what we say here. i want to say when i said newt gingrich was a bad person i thought i was clear. he was -- his political character -- when he puts on that political helmet he becomes a very bad actor. just like a football player may be great off the field. may be a wonderful dad, wonderful husband, etcetera. but sometimes put on a helmet and take cheap shots. that's what i'm talking about. when newt gingrich calls good people like secretary sebelius,
who i may disagree with her politically, but you know what? she's given her life to public service, when he compares her to joseph stalin, a guy who killed 30 million people, and when that's the norm for newt, it's just not a nice person. >> i think you've made that clear but i also think people will take advantage of it anyway so get ready. >> i don't care. i won't read the blogs. i just want the people who watch to know. i don't know him personally though i worked with him but i kind of like it that way. >> michele bachmann will be here, robert gibbs, and tom brokaw. up next a political exclusive. our elite romney supporters starting to show signs of nerves? that's next. first here is bill karins with a check on the forecast. good morning. it's going to be a rough morning commute. we have fog to deal with down in the carolinas and we're also dealing with rain up through areas of new england. that's going to move into the big cities. the green on the map is rain mostly but vermont, new hampshire, massachusetts, there's also more showers heading for the big cities
latder on today. bring the umbrella with you. forecast wise it's going to be definitely on the warm side. temperatures in the 50s this time of the morning. so this is it though. this is the last warm day for the big cities of the east coast as the rain moves through. eventually it'll cool off. all of that cold air locked in the middle of the country. how does that wind chill of minus 15 feel this morning in denver? eventually the cold air will meet up with some of that rain. i think we'll look for a possibility of a snowstorm in some areas of the east as we go through wednesday night into thursday. i'll have more details on that tomorrow. if you live up in central new england you may need to get the snow shovel ready. you're watching "morning joe" brewed by starbucks. i'd like one of those desserts and some coffee. sure. cake or pie? pie. apple or cherry? cherry. oil or cream? oil or cream? cream. reddi-wip uses real dairy cream. nothing's more real than reddi-wip.
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>> i believe these words came from the pokemon movie. life can seem impossible. it's never easy when there is so much on the line. >> yes -- stirring words. it reminds me of when ronald reagan challenged america to be great again by saying -- scoopy scoopy -- scoobi doobi doo where are you? we've got some work to do now. >> i can't believe he quoted that song. pokemon. >> it's stunning. >> we were talking during the break. do you know who -- of course we love him and have always loved him. but you know who right now just every morning wakes up and bangs his head against the wall? mike huckabee.
xo if mike huckabee had won this year he would be president. more than anybody else out there, mike huckabee, this year, would run away with iowa. he would run away with south carolina. he would be competitive in florida. wow. >> it's amazing. time to take a look at the morning papers. we'll start with "the wall street journal." it says a former executive at mf global raised serious concerns several times last year about the growing bet his boss john corzine was making on european bonds well before the company tumbled into bankruptcy. corzine responded by saying mf global's exposure was limited and the likely profit was worth the risk. >> and the "new york times" says record numbers of government workers are putting in for retirement before their salaries and benefits take more of a hit. the number of retirees is way up in wisconsin where more applications have been filed this year than ever before.
retirements in california and new jersey also soaring. >> all right. from our parade of papers now, today marks the 130th anniversary of the los angeles times. wow. a special commemorative section takes readers on a walk through the history of southern california. from the rise of hollywood to natural disasters and the political careers of presidents. >> speaking of natural disasters, willie -- >> oh, lord. he is one walking natural disaster. >> speaking of wisconsin and natural disasters, we've got them all here in one. >> we teamed it up perfectly for the executive director of politico mr. jim vandehai. >> good morning. how are you? i'm still stunned by the pokemon thing. >> i know. >> i don't even want to joke about it. >> you see it every day and you can't believe it's real that happened. we'll talk more about it later. >> i believe -- >> stop it. >> pokemon said this.
>> at the top of the polls. i know smart people who really wanted to vote for him. >> you were really rubbing that in. you are. >> yeah guys. >> so mika went out to dinner a month ago. >> i went to a nice club in my town with very good friends who happened to be republicans. >> and they were talking down to mika all night about how cain was going to win. >> it was a debate about occupy wall street and the candidate they loved is herman cain. my friends, god bless you. i love you very much. >> they'll hear about this for the rest of their lives. >> i don't think she loves them that much. >> no, i do. >> just judging by this tone. >> i do. >> and so now -- >> we were shouted down. all right. >> right there at your own table huh? >> it's all right. >> i believe pokemon -- >> that's what good friends do. >> let's talk to jim about mitt romney, his supporters expressing a little concern about his strategy. mark just said in our last segment, romney needs to head off newt gingrich now before this thing gets any bigger than it is. what's the concern for mitt supporters? >> in homage to herman cain they wanted to be more like bam-bam.
wanted to start clubbing newt gingrich because they feel that this timid approach is allowed for this huge opening to exist for months now and they want him to be much more aggressive in going after newt gingrich. they see him as a much more serious threat than the main stream media is taking him. they look at these polls in south carolina this morning, three in iowa, and say, you know what? you could say he's the front-run fer you actually look at performance over the last week and they feel mitt romney has to be much, much more aggressive in the next couple of weeks or this is going to be a much tougher race than any of them anticipated a few weeks ago. >> you've got a great quote in the piece from trent lott who came out for romney early. he said, i have disagreed with his strategies from senator lott. i think he could have closed the deal out before now. he has run too much of a risk averse campaign. that's coming from a guy who supported romney right from the beginning. >> and there's a lot of donors that we talked to for this piece that are quoted. many of them on the record. all with the same theme basically saying he's too timid. that he needs to be more aggressive in going after newt
gingrich, in drawing distinctions, in protecting his own image. you know, this has been probably the toughest couple of week period for mitt romney in the campaign and it's at the worst possible time because voters are going to start voting in less than a month. newt gingrich is doing one heck of a job on riding this imponderable wave, one that nobody saw coming months ago. if you told me a year ago this would be happening i'd have said you're on drugs. >> right. >> romney better start looking because he is down 15 in iowa and 18 in south carolina. >> you know, willie, this will be a great test of how agile romney is and how agile the political -- because being risk averse has paid great dividends up until this past week. >> right. >> now it's -- better turn on a dime. >> four weeks from today. >> all right. >> oh, my lord. >> four weeks from today! newt gingrich is laughing. jim, holy cow! >> what's that?
>> i said, we're four weeks from today, and newt is lapping the field for those of us who have known him and worked with him closely like you and me. >> right. >> unthinkable. >> unthinkable. i was trying to think of a parallel. you have to go back to nixon to see somebody that's had this big of a comeback in politics. given his reputation here, his reputation nationally, the state of his campaign, and for him to come roaring back with arguably more baggage than any candidate. >> anybody. >> that we've seen in campaigns in a long, long time. >> anybody. >> it's like voters are saying, whatever we've heard this, we know newt and we like his performance on stage. we don't like mitt romney. so what the heck? let's go for it. >> and, yes. nixon came back but nixon came back -- it was 1962 to 1968 after he lost to brown in '62. newt, this summer imploded, willie. >> he was the butt of jokes. tiffany's and the greek cruise and now here he is. >> there we go.
>> jim, thanks so much. still ahead here, with the reverend al sharpton, chuck todd. up next the heisman trophy finalists. >> i like this one. >> look out for the honey badger. >> he can run. >> he is the best player in college football. >> oh, be quiet. looking good! you lost some weight. you noticed! these clothes are too big, so i'm donating them. how'd you do it? eating right, whole grain. [ female announcer ] people who choose more whole grain tend to weigh less than those who don't. multigrain cheerios... five whole grains, 110 calories.
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all right. we have our heisman finalist announced yesterday. here they are. >> honey badger? >> honey badger is there. stanford's andrew luck the quarterback. baylor's quarterback robert griffin iii. the only two qbs facing rough competition. trent richardson the alabama running back and the honey badger there he is tiranne mathieu, the cornerback. also wisconsin running back montee ball. >> who quietly had as good a season statistically as anybody. >> if he scores two touchdowns in the bowl game he'll have more than any running back in a single season. a huge yir. if you handicap it, we talked to chris fowler yesterday. they do the straw polls. robert griffin iii is polling very high right now. luck was the runner-up last year so he was kind of the front-runner coming in. a lot of people saying it might be this kid from baylor which would be a great story. great season, great career. >> as you said, harold, luck
is -- >> i think luck probably has better pro potential when you look at the size but barkley had one heck of a year at usc. >> i think the honey badger coming up splits up the s.e.c. vote enough and as you said, you think there is an s.e.c. >> who would you go for? who is number two and three? >> i would put trent one and rg iii two. >> i put mathieu. i put mathieu. best player in the country. >> i mean -- >> honey badger. >> you got three or four really great players. >> great players and they're all new york this weekend. mika's must read opinion pages next. nyquil (st uffy
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newt. republican strategists who were never persuaded michele bachmann posed a credible threat and who maintained a similar skepticism about cain say that the gingrich challenge is different and that he could really be the one to ruin things for romney. for democrats, that would be a god send. the benefit of familiarity won't work as well for gingrich in the general election where he would be a more polarizing figure than romney whose blandness and ideological squishiness have an upside. although gingrich has gone through his own policy contortions, his image and personality are more sharply defined, petulant, truculent, arrogant. if voters supporting him in the primaries were going to be turned off by that, wouldn't it have happened already? that's one. i got another on the other side of the aisle from "the washington post." mark thesen, a friend. >> yep. >> he says time for mitt romney to take the mits off. with gingrich as the nominee one
romney adviser told me the election will become a race about yesterday instead of tomorrow. it'll be about his tumultuous speakership rather than obama's failed presidency. that's not the kind of race you want to run. team romney says, for now, the romney campaign is leaving that argument to others. but it may not be able to do so for long. romney strategists likened the campaign to an indy 500 race. you drive steady, let other cars rub metal and spin out and make sure you are there in the last lap. the problem is, you need eventually to rub some metal yourself and make a move if you want to cross the finish line first. >> and so we have these two, and you -- you pointed out, mark, a great op-ed from the "new york post." the paragraph you picked out, and john talks about how we've been there before. he talks about, we remember him going through one of the great political flameouts of all time. we remember he talks about how
he tarnished his own republican revolution before it even started in '94 with a $4.5 million book deal. he talks about all of the mistakes that newt gingrich has made and why he would be such an easy target for barack obama, but he also explains why republicans like him right now. and this is the paragraph you picked out, mark. quote, they know him mainly from fox news. they know he got a republican congress elected, which they like the sound of. and they've watched him playing the debates like a piano and enjoyed themselves enorm ously n the process. >> there has been from the beginning even when newt was collapsing a disconnect between what people in washington and establishment circles think of him and his potential and what real voters care about. just being on fox news for years communicating with people, comparing mitt romney just on that metric, is a huge advantage for gingrich. >> agreed. >> harold -- >> but when you -- he said it
earlier, joe. think about this. and some of the pieces raised by one of the columns. number one, i remember, as much as people are excited about his speakership he did sign a book deal right away. he was run out of the speakership four years after he was elected. can you imagine if he's president, him negotiating with the other party around issues with his propensity to make statements -- can you imagine putting him in a room with russian leaders, afghan leaders, chinese leaders? i don't think he wins iowa as i've said. i think these issues will come out. this is a great moment for him, a great run. almost like when kentucky plays idaho state and idaho state has a great run. it goes on a 12-0 run in the second half with ten minutes left. what happens? they get it back together. >> in this case idaho has won a national championship before. >> national championship that gingrich -- he made it to the final four. he didn't make the championship. >> i'm talking about newt
engineered historic, legislative landslide. he has been a national figure. he's been "time" magazine's person of the year. he has been there before. i think he's going to collapse over time. that said, mika, he has been to the top. he has had his -- as this column says -- >> he was governor. i just think that -- >> there is nothing like being on a national stage and being beaten up every day politically like newt gingrich has. he hasn't learned his lessons. we'll see if he has a second time. but i want to go back to the point of fox news. he's been on fox news as mark said for such a long time, and fox news drives primary voters. republican primary voters because they all, you know, they all watch it. >> you can shape a message and get right to your base on fox news. and that has been brilliant on his part. and back to all of his train wrecks, whatever you want to call it, he has weathered them.
that's going to be attractive to people right now who are trying to figure out why they can't get their arms around mitt romney. >> you know, i think it was the "new york times" had a piece a couple days ago, i think maybe friday or so, saying there aren't as many town hall meetings in iowa and new hampshire now because republicans know if they can get on fox news they reach the voters there. that fox news has changed the way campaigns are run on the republican side. >> a lot easier than having to schlepp around. you get right to them. >> yeah. >> i think it is all really good news for the president of the united states. still ahead, we'll bring in michele bachmann and robert gibbs. willie's news you can't use is next up. [ female announcer ] wish you had that list huh? the one you swore you could memorize.
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it's time. time for the news you can't use. >> are you sure? >> we talked a little bit about herman cain. >> this is going to be useless right? >> totally worthless. >> all right. >> no value whatsoever. good. >> we talked about herman cain citing pokemon. >> that was useless. the pokemon 2000 song. run over the closing credits. sung by donna sommer. >> herman cain saying the greatest nine words ever spoken by an american politician.
>> i believe these words came from the pokemon movie. [ cheering ] >> herman cain's farewell address, words of wisdom to his followers and supporters. the final moments of his campaign are from the closing credits of the pokemon movie. the thing they play to get you the [ bleep ] out of the theater. first of all it's not even the most inspirational quote from the pokemon movie. >> i see now that the circumstances of one's birth are irrelevant. it is what you do with the gift of life that determines who you are. >> well said. well said, minimum wage japanese cat monster, who was created as the result of a genetic experiment and therefore has psychic powers that far exceed those of its fellow pokemon.
well said. of course, considering what led cain to drop out of the race this is the pokemon 2000 line he really should have quoted. >> i could use pants. >> the tributes to herman cain just keep rolling in. i don't give anything away. you may see one on this show at the end of this week. >> what? >> there is a chance. >> in the week in review? >> perhaps. could be a special edition. >> i'm already on the edge of my seat. >> could be the only thing to make the cut. >> you know what? i think we should have a reverend quoting pokemon, herman cain quoting. we could do something -- >> the greatest promo in the history of television is airing right now on msnbc where the reverend al sharpton stands on the stoop and talks about the blueberry pie all over the face. they were the ones eating the pie. >> in "the wall street journal",
there is a fitness routine. >> yeah. >> i'm going to tell the secret that he exposes behind it. it involves somebody on this set. >> how does he find the time? al sharpton, next. ♪ [ electronic beeping ] [ male announcer ] still getting dandruff? neutrogena® t/gel shampoo defeats dandruff after just one use. t/gel shampoo. it works. neutrogena®. ♪ my hair is gone ♪ cheap cologne ♪ motor home ♪ i'm the rocket man! [ both ] ♪ rocket man ♪ burning out his fuse up here alone ♪ burning out his fuse up here alone? ahh. [ male announcer ] crystal clear fender premium audio. one of many premium features available on the all-new volkswagen passat. the 2012 motor trend car of the year. ♪ and i think it's gonna be a long, long time ♪
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i'm howard spielberg of fidelity investments. the equity summary score is one more innovative reason serious investors are choosing fidelity. get 200 free trades today and explore your next investing idea. i want to be the nominee. it is very hard to look at the recent polls and not think the odds are very high i'm going to be the nominee. >> that's what's so crazy.
republicans are up newt creek without a paddle. why will newt be the nominee? >> those guys were the new kid on the block and isn't this wonderful, boy it would be great if it worked out, and we don't know anything about them. i'm the guy who's been around forever. >> that's newt gingrich's pitch. i'm the fiend that has been in your pantry forever -- you can try your new fangled pop tarts and eggo waffles but if you look way back in there, there is a can of la choy baby corn. a product that may or may not still be offered by the la choy company. you don't remember buying it yet you don't remember ever being without it. and now you have no choice but to elect it president. i'm newt gingrich and i approve this message. >> top of the hour. that's as good as it gets. welcome back to "morning joe." mark halperin and harold ford jr. are still with us and joining the table we have the
host of msnbc's "politics nation" and president of the national action network, reverend al sharpton, who is in the health and wellness section of "the wall street journal." reverend sharpton's power talking fitness routine. look at this. but this is an incredible story. reverend al was 300 pounds at one time. >> holy cow! >> 305. >> wow. >> now you look good. >> you look sexy. you have brought sexy back to this set. >> now that's just -- >> brought sexy back. wow. >> but look at him. he is the justin timberlake of "morning joe." >> we're both going to get a lot of tweets off of that one. >> so here's -- you go through in this article, your workout, your diet. it's amazing. >> i can't a wait to read this. >> i think it's fantastic. but i'm confused here. you talk about your gear and then the play list. >> yeah. >> most mornings reverend sharpton watches msnbc's "morning joe." a show on which he is a regular guest. while working out he watches it. he says host joe scarborough is
his morning inspiration. >> what? well that's awfully nice. >> quote -- >> that is awesome. thank you. >> let me finish. >> he likes me. he really likes me. >> let me finish. what does he say? >> he just hits my spot and gets me so angry and ready to go to work while i'm on the bike or running. >> what? >> i think of my counterarguments to his conservative ones. >> what? well that's hurtful. >> oh, well. you're helping him lose weight so that's good. >> i help a lot of liberals wake up across america every morning by making them angry. >> yeah. >> you do. i actually turn the speed up when you start attacking the president. >> i don't attack the president. >> yes. i'm going to ask you to play a counterintuitive role because i need to be educated on the newt gingrich front. we have some newt gingrich news that are headlines this morning, but you, of course, traveled the country with newt gingrich. >> right. >> on an education campaign. so i'm hoping you can sort of help me see the other side of the story. joe is objective. i'm not yet. but perhaps you can help me.
>> well, i'm very confused. president obama as joe and i have talked about said -- he asked newt gingrich and i to tour the country with the education secretary for education reform. the confusion is that we went to a lot of these poor communities, inner cities, that newt now claims such ignorance about. he says that these poor communities have no work the ethic. their parents don't go to work. the only monetary trade is illegal. those are the communities that he and i toured. >> was he saying that when you were there? >> no. >> that the only way these kids can make money is by doing something illegal? was he saying that with you? >> no. he was saluting them. we went on "meet the press" together and talked about how these kids needed an opportunity because look how well they were doing. the first city we went in, philadelphia, the school went from the bottom to the top in academic achievement. their parents were there. >> newt just said though that the only way these kids could make any money, by doing things
illegally. he wasn't saying that when he was with you and when went in to work with the president and you on education reform? >> not at all. that's why i'm confused. so newt has either had a real case of amnesia or he's playing -- it is one thing to say something offensive but itas nother thing to say something you know is not -- >> let me ask you, because i am really curious, you listen to what he says about the president. he says awful things about the president. i disagree with the president but i've always said he's a good man. i'm sure he's a good father and good husband and loves his country and is doing what he thinks is best even if i personally disagree with it. newt, though, has said some horrible things about this president. i'm just curious. when you walked into the white house to meet with the president, was he stand offish and kind of rude to him? >> not at all. in fact, he commended the president for doing things in the area of education and there's the footage of newt gingrich standing with me coming
outside of the meeting with the president. he doesn't seem disturbed to me. he certainly was very respectful of the president. >> and he liked working with the president. >> he liked working with the president and me. in fact, just four weeks ago he called me on the show on this station to wish me a happy birthday on the air. >> well that's nice. >> isn't that nice. >> joe didn't even call me. >> i didn't know it was your birthday. you know what, newt doesn't say horrible things in me in the newspaper like you do. >> i said you inspire me. because somebody has to try to counter you. >> you are an inspiration, joe. >> he hates when loving would be so much easier. >> you're an inspiration in your own special, convoluted way. >> okay. >> yes. twisted. by the way, by the end of this block we need to get to the payroll tax cut fight because democrats are putting forward a solution that would be paid for and i'd like to get to that story at some point. we do talk about newt gingrich a lot. he is the headline this morning. the gingrich campaign is ramping up efforts in iowa at this point as new polling there shows the
former house speaker with a sizable lead in the early caucus state, with less than a month to go before voting. an abc news/"the washington post" poll shows gingrich with 33% support of likely republican caucus goers. that is 15 points ahead of mitt romney and ron paul who were tied for second. >> mark halperin, these numbers are pretty astounding. the question is, does newt hold on and win iowa? do you see that as the most plausible outcome? >> i think unless the romney campaign takes him on direct lane chooses the right things to take him on with i think he wins iowa. >> if he wins iowa going away can he win new hampshire? >> i think he could. romney has a bit of a fire wall there and new hampshire sometimes goes against what iowa does rather than following the momentum of iowa but i think gingrich would come out big so let's say, let's just go and say, though, newt wins iowa. mitt wins new hampshire. then you go to south carolina, a state that has always
traditionally been the fire wall for main stream, traditional establishment republican candidates. that seems like the place that would be newt's waterloo. but right now he's doing well. >> the poll out today has him doing well. romney is not the perfect establishment candidate for south carolina. he didn't serve in the military. he's not invested much time there. the establishment there is weaker than it's been in the past when they rallied around the establishment candidate. that's where the establishment nationally at least would have to go in and try to prop up romney. i'm not sure that's going to be possible. >> harold, you look at this iowa poll. 33 to 18% newt way ahead. almost doubling mitt romney. but you still think newt doesn't win iowa. why? >> look. four weeks ago he was nowhere to be found. now don't get me wrong. i think everything you've said and everything that has been said by mark and i, i think the reverend is right. the reverend has given i think -- if you're mitt romney's o advise thers morning you have to listen to what reverend sharpton has said this morning to counter him. you're not going to counter newt
gingrich without substance. you're not going to counter newt gingrich without showing his massive inconsistencies on substance. put aside the personal issues. go after him on substance. now, i say that romney can find his way back not because i support mitt romney but because this republican primary has taken such shifts over the last several weeks. the last 30 days, just like the last trading day on the market, is the most momentous, most important, and most tumultuous. the question is whether or not mitt romney knows why he wants to be president. if he can -- if he can reach deep down and talk about those issues, talk about the country, and then contrast himself with newt, i think he finds himself in a good position. he has the money to do it. it will be interesting to see if he can. if he doesn't do it and newt gingrich does emerge i have to tell you as a democrat and someone who supports the president it's good news for my party. >> i want to play the david axelrod bite. he called newt gingrich the godfather of gridlock i believe. do we have that, alex? here it is. then reverend al. >> i was amused by the newt gingrich ad by the way because he talked about he is going to
bring the country together to solve problems. you talk about the godfather of gridlock here, the guy who, you know, two decades ago really invented the kind of tactics that have now become common place in washington, so this is a whole new newt. >> we heard it here first. the obama case against newt. >> well, i think it may be the public's case against him. i don't think people want to go back to that. >> all right. so they're going after him. which also means that he is making gains, which clearly show up in the polls. why is he doing so well, reverend al? explain. >> well, i think that it is clear that there is a large segment of the republican party -- voters and establishment -- that don't want mitt romney. i think that -- >> why is that? >> i have no idea. but i think that newt is the last man standing. he's -- he knows how to exploit that. and he's trying to redo himself in many areas. i think if i were advising romney and i certainly don't support romney, i would do as harold said. i would take him on the substance of the issues. for example, joe, yesterday he's in new york talking about some
apprentice program with donald trump. well, everyone does the tabloid analysis of that. what i would say is fine. explain to me what all your companies mr. gingrich and mr. trump, how many people out of these communities have you hired now? show me your employment role in diversity. bring in ten kids after you both have multimillion dollar industries, show us what you already have done in these areas because on the substance is where i think he would go down. if romney doesn't discover his comfort level, get comfortable with his own skin as a candidate and deal with why he's running, how he's running, and then use that to go against newt, he beats himself. >> you know, the thing is, mika, harold brought up a good point where he said, mitt romney has to figure out why he wants to be president. i suspect for most republican primary voters right now they believe mitt romney wants to be president because mitt romney
wants to be president. >> right. >> newt gingrich could tell you if you asked him the famous roger -- was it roger mudd with ted kennedy in 1980 why do you want to be president? newt could answer that question. jeb could answer that question. chris christie could answer that question. michele bachmann could answer that question. they all could -- mitch daniels could answer that question. >> you're saying mitt romney couldn't answer that question? >> i don't, right now, i could answer those questions for you. like for instance if you ask me why chris christie would want to be president i could answer that question. jeb, i could answer the question. mitch daniel, i could answer that question. jon huntsman i could answer that question. michele bachmann. ron paul. i could answer it. if you asked me why mitt romney wanted to be president, i could not answer that question because mitt's campaign has decided they're going to play it safe. they're going to say as little as possible. and they're going to keep him away from interviews as much as possible. and that has brought us to this point. >> that has worked, though. up until now for him as the
others have come and gone he stayed above the fray, which was an obama strategy in the campaign as well. but now he's being confronted with the questions that have been held up, held up, held up because he hasn't put himself in front of the cameras and he's not so comfortable answering that. >> let's go around really quickly here. answer the question. you could answer the question. why would chris christie want to be president? really quickly. why does mitt romney want to be president? from all that you've heard why does he want to be president? >> look. that is for him to answer. i don't know. i assume because he has been a good business person. >> no, no. that's not the question. why does he want -- >> i don't know. >> okay. why does ron paul want to be president? you know the answer to that. >> i think he wants to get -- government is too big -- >> what would mitt romney -- how would he answer that question? what does mitt romney -- >> to turn the economy around because the failed president in the white house, mitt romney -- the president has been a failure
and is not up to the job and he could turn it around. >> the fact he's been running for four years and we don't know is very telling. >> this is the second time around. the president wasn't there last time. this is your second time around and america doesn't know why you're running. that means he either doesn't have a reason or he doesn't know how to communicate the reason. >> the difference with gingrich? >> he needs to get on fox news. >> gingrich has been more effective than anybody running -- cain, trump, bachmann, all the people on the rise -- gingrich, what everyone has said about him, and reverend sharpton saw this, we both served with him, he is a smart guy. i mean, he is very calculating. he has a philosophy that he would like to see government operate by. i don't agree with it but i got to tell you he is good articulating and whether you like it or not he is an ambidextrous and intellectually ambidextrous guy. >> he attacks politics fan they come after newt on anything that is close to personal he will attack back and to be in a fight in the last few days with newt gingrich very dangerous. >> michele bachmann will be on the show next hour.
>> will be great to talk to her. >> look forward to it. >> because michele bachmann should be the favorite daughter of iowa. there may be -- i think michele bachmann may have a second act in iowa. believe it or not, i think rick perry could have a second act in south carolina. i think we -- this campaign has a few more twists and turns. >> i call you a man of faith. >> you know i'm a man of faith. southern baptist. from way back. >> until i saw your commercial. >> oh, come on. >> your southern baptist roots. >> you love that promo and you know it. >> i love seeing mika run through the streets of new york. >> it wasn't like harold's commercials in 2006 where he's in a pew. that was good. that was a good commercial. that's where he learned his values. >> but i've seen him in the pew live. >> exactly. >> he really goes to the pew. i hope you really don't need to be woke up in the morning like i saw you. >> the defibrillator. only about half the time.
>> got everybody's attention. >> thank you. that was very good. >> thank you very much. >> the white house will argue that while this is going on with the republican presidential candidates trying to sort each other out, that they're just working on trying to defend the middle class. the obama administration is up with a revamped web page piling on the pressure for congress to pass an extension of the payroll tax cuts, a key component of the president's jobs bill. a countdown clock is running on white house.gov indicating that if congress doesn't act by that december 31st deadline, a tax hike for the middle class will take effect. i don't understand how the republicans could let that happen. at a daily white house briefing, president obama, who has said middle class families should see taxes jump by $1,000 if the measure expires, took aim at republicans for what he calls a shifting position on tax relief. >> i know many republicans have sworn an oath never to raise taxes as long as they live.
how could it be that the only time there is a catch is when it comes to raising taxes on middle class families? how can you fight tooth and nail to protect high end tax breaks for the wealthiest americans and yet barely lift a finger to prevent taxes going up for 160 million americans who really need the help. it doesn't make sense. >> you know, it doesn't make sense. harold ford jr., help me out here. because isn't there some sort of bipartisan proposal to pay for this by raising taxes only on the wealthy and bypassing small businesses so that they are left out of the tax hike? why can't this happen? >> democrats have done what republicans have not done in the congress. they have urged tax relief actually for middle class america. and they decided to pay for it. in the past as we've all known and i was there when republicans argued we should continue serving tax relief that was passed a few years before because if we didn't it would be considered a tax increase, the irony for me, and joe and i have
disagreed on grover norquist's role in this whole tax debate, i am disappointed in grover norquist in this debate. i applaud him politically but he has been remarkably, conspicuously silent as this notion of a tax increase has come about for 160 million americans. if i were president obama and his political team, i take mr. norquist on personally. dare him to join hands with them to urge congress and this rare bipartisan moment to not raise taxes on the majority of americans who clean up in this country, the majority of americans who make sure offices work, make our cabs work, the ones who actually fix things in our homes and businesses. >> how exciting! i have two democrats here who are actually for tax cuts. it's about time. >> i've been a tax cutter for a while but we know this. i've been a tax cutter my entire time in the congress. we know this. this is a tax increase. where is grover? where is grover? >> mark, it is liberating and, yes, as the reverend al said, i'm a man of faith and i now have harold ford jr. preaching the gospel of jack kemp and all
i can say is hallelujah. what's going on in washington? >> and democrats are paying for it. >> that's right. >> the first post super committee failure fight democrats are winning handily and republicans better find a way out of this or they will do -- >> romney endorsed it. >> let me ask you, mark, why are republicans like jon kyl against this tax cut? what is their argument? >> they don't think it is necessarily stimulative and it needs to be paid for. >> well it's going to be paid for if they would just actually take part in the conversation and -- >> why do you think he is proposing it, joe? >> this has been effective because they say they aren't taking part in the conversation. if you were to go down a laundry list of bills tha paul ryan and the republicans in the house of representatives have passed, only to be killed in the senate, we can do that. but, you know what? >> but this is paid for. that's not an argument. >> just don't say republicans are doing nothing because that's just not the truth. if you want to talk about this one bill, that's fine. let's debate that one bill but
i've heard both of you people say oh, republicans have done absolutely nothing. >> i didn't say that. >> no you did say that. we can go back and look at the tape. republicans -- the fact is -- >> they didn't support a tax revenue increase and they did it because of grover norquist. >> joe, why is jon kyl opposing this? that as question i ask. >> i don't know the answer, john. what is the answer? >> i don't know. >> it is not stimulate if aive there needs to be offsets for everything and they want other reforms in conjunction with it. it as bad place for them to be. they are against a tax cut for the middle class and continuing to defend tax cuts for the wealthy which the public overwhelmingly favors. >> i think politically, mika, to get to the substance of this, i think democrats are winning big time on this issue and as you said, harold, that's one of the reasons why mitt romney is in support of this tax bill. >> he needs to distinguish himself and be aggressive. >> i don't think he's got that
in him. we'll see though. >> coming up robert gibbs weighs in on president obama's strategy for 2012. it'll be great to talk to him again. plus chuck todd will join the conversation and here in the studio former senator george lemie lemieux. we'll talk about his republican primary fight in florida. >> we'll ask him who he thinks is going to win if newt can win florida. i know the name of eight princesses. i'm an expert on softball. and tea parties. i'll have more awkward conversations than i'm equipped for because i'm raising two girls on my own. i'll worry about the economy more than a few times before they're grown. but it's for them, so i've found a way. who matters most to you says the most about you. massmutual is owned by our policyholders so they matter most to us. massmutual. we'll help you get there. to bring you a low-priced medicare prescription drug plan. ♪ with the lowest national plan premium... ♪
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24 past the hour. joining us now former republican senator from florida, senator george lemieux who is running for senate again in florida. and nbc news chief white house correspondent and political director and host of "the daily rundown" chuck todd. chuck, good to have you. >> we'll have -- mark asked a fascinating question to senator lemieux a moment ago about florida and we'll get to that in a second. first, chuck todd, let's go to you. wow. this snowball is picking up momentum going down hill. a new "the washington post" poll shows newt gingrich nearly doubling mitt romney in iowa and everybody else he's at 33% to mitt romney's 18%.
from what i'm starting to hear, a lot of nervousness. people believing that this is going to lead to the possibility of a gingrich nomination leads to days a disastrous general eln next year. what are you hearing? >> some trepidation. you talk to some folks over the last couple days and it's not a panic yet because there still seems to be a lot of the republicans i talked to who all just assume, well, we've seen, a, we've seen this before in this primary campaign and, b, we've seen this before with newt. so combine those would forces, right? that no anti-mitt romney has been able to sustain it and newt gingrich, his political career is a series of unsustainable surges. that said, i tell you, the most important poll number this morning i think is coming out of south carolina. >> i agree. >> i agree.
>> where does mitt romney win if gingrich, if he loses both iowa and south carolina? i'm sorry. it's certainly not the state of florida. that is a closed republican primary. >> let me ask you, chuck. if newt gingrich wins iowa, newt gingrich wins south carolina, doesn't newt gingrich win florida? >> i -- the florida republican primary is closed. and what that means is it's only registered republicans. that electorate is going to be more conservative than maybe some people think a florida republican primary normally would be. and you have to say gingrich would be the heavy -- >> george lemieux, senator from florida, newt is running away with florida in a lot of polls. how does newt gingrich fare in your state that you represented in the united states senate? >> the numbers for newt in the polls are really amazing. he was in single digits and now he's at, you know, 38%, 40% of the polls.
we'll see what happens. >> mark, ask him the question you asked off sound. >> senator, nice to see you. a lot of debate about general election electability. iowa caucus voters are shown to think gingrich would be a stronger candidate by a little bit over mitt romney. in your state you hope to be the general election candidate for senate. who do you think would be a stronger general election candidate -- mitt romney or newt gingrich in your state? >> the one political answer i'll give you is on presidential politics i think they both would be good. >> ha ha. >> they both bring different things to the table. again, i'll be political about that. i'm focused on my own race. either one would be better than barack obama. newt gingrich is an idea factory. he's brought a lot of great ideas to the republican party. mitt romney brings his business experience. i think both are good alternatives. >> some people in the establishment say gingrich would be a disaster if he were your nominee. that you and other people would be imperilled. you think gingrich would be a strong -- >> i do not think that at all. i think he has shown he can be disciplined. he's done that in the past weeks
and months and i think he is running a good campaign. he wouldn't be where he is today if he weren't running -- >> have you seen private polling on florida? >> no. i've seen the public polling. >> chuck todd, let me bring you back in here. >> yeah. >> i think these gingrich polls are -- and i'm sure you agree with me here -- are just like the palin polls, the trump polls, the cain polls, the bachmann polls. it's more about mitt romney than it is about the person beating mitt romney. and the romney people have been pretty arrogant up to this point, saying donald trump is great for us. michele bachmann is great for us. they're not saying that any more. are they? >> no they're not. >> they're nervous. >> they should be nervous now because while, yes, the gingrich surge is again a result of the surge for the anti-mitt romney by conservatives, and remember, you know, one of the more striking results in our nbc maris polls in both iowa and new
hampshire was how large majorities of the republican electorate say they're conservative and those same large majorities say mitt romney is a moderate and moderates don't win republican primaries very often. it just doesn't happen. mr. lemieux, senator lemieux knows this very well. just ask charlie crist. >> you would know this well correct? >> the most conservative person on the candidates usually wins in florida. >> the "new york times" has an article and we've been following this and other reporting as well that newt gingrich's organization has certainly suffered over the past weeks and months and that they potentially got money issues in terms of being able to jump back in big time. will they be able to compete on that level? he certainly has the surge but can he back it up with an organized campaign? >> it's unclear and don't forget the super pacs can make up for a lot. he's always had, particularly there is a gentleman out of vegas that i'm drawing a blank, the gentleman that owns the venetian hotel out there, that for years mark probably will
remember the name as soon as i'm done speaking, for years has been a big funder of gingrich's causes. i wouldn't be surprised if somebody plops a couple million dollars in a super pac to make up the -- to make up for any issues that newt has but i tell you, we see the numbers. this ad he has out, in iowa, it's a $220,000 ad buy spread over two weeks. that means you're barely going to see the ad. >> boy. that does not buy much. so, senator lemieux, let's talk about barack obama for a moment. this has to be, well you won't admit it because you're running for office. this has to be frustrating for you. i can tell it you's frustrating for a lot of florida republicans. what is barack obama's approval rating in florida? >> he is under o50. i think he is in the low 40s. >> this should be a huge republican year and, yet, nobody has stepped forward and taken advantage of barack obama's
weaknesses. >> i don't think any -- i don't think barack obama is going to win florida. i think the republican candidate is going to win florida. i think we're going to beat bill nelson. hopefully i'm that candidate in november. we've got a million people out of work in florida. 10.5% unemployment. >> is it still 10.5%? >> 24% of all the home foreclosures in the country -- >> you have an unpopular florida governor though. wean rick scott and like him but he is down in the 30s. doesn't that help bill nelson against you? >> i don't think so. i think people will focus on our race. there are real differences between me and bill nelson. i think it's the first time the senate historian told me in the history of the country that two senators who served together run against each other so i voted against obama care. he voted for it. i voted against dodd/frank he voted for it. i voted against trying the 9/11 terrorists in new york city. he voted for it. those are clear differences. >> i have a great idea. i'm a florida guy. i like you. i like bill nelson. we ought to get twou here on a debate. >> let's do it. >> if senator nelson, he is a
great guy. if senator nelson would come that would be great. >> let december that. >> thank you so much. we will see you back at the debate. let's get that together. >> i would love that. chuck todd, you got in a scrap yesterday. we'll get you up here if you can come up. that would be a lot of fun. but are you going to fight anybody today on your show? come on, man. >> i'm not a fighter. i'm not a fighter. i think that's the problem. it's a one way feud. i don't know what i did to a man who is worth so much money. >> boy, donald wasn't happy. >> no, he's not been happy with me for a while. i guess i just don't play his game. i don't know. i don't get it. >> who do you have on today? >> a little more normal show today. we have the bnc chair coming up and two freshmen, democrat and regime co regime -- republican coming on
together. members of congress who are kind of frustrated and working together. >> you have seen and we have seen and they see this in polling, chuck, they see this in polling. we've seen republicans and democrats coming on shows together. i know you've seen it, too. >> yes. >> they are seeing in their polls and hearing it at home, we want to see you working with the other side. even the most conservative people. this is a new strategy. go on chuck's show. go on "morning joe." >> that's right. >> go on these other shows with a democrat or with a republican. >> maybe agree on the payroll -- >> isn't that fascinating? >> they're playing with fire. that's why. it could be ugly. >> yeah. going to be ugly. >> jufrt ahead, standing by, in the green room robert gibbs. >> how exciting. >> gibby back on the show. >> i'm going to ask him about how auburn is going to do in the national championships. wait. that was last year. ♪
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♪ shake it up shake it up coming december 27th, the only debate that matters. >> sadly, i'm going to have to fire one of you. it is my decision and i'm going to make a decision. >> the donald trump presidential debate. >> who is your weakest player? asking the tough questions. >> if you were me, who would you fire? >> the first person to fire is
bernanke. >> he spent what, three or four years in jail didn't he? this is really bothering you, isn't it? >> the donald trump presidential debate on december 27th. someone's getting fired. >> turn off your television. that's all you get to see. >> okay. >> look at this. this like mount rushmore. >> it is. coming up next, obama campaign adviser robert gibbs and nbc's tom brokaw. keep it right here on "morning joe." [ baby coughing ]
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with no blackout dates. ♪ imagine me and you, i do ♪ i think about you day and night ♪ ♪ it's only right ♪ to think about the girl you love ♪ ♪ and hold her tight ♪ so happy together [ male announcer ] when life changes, so can your insurances needs. use travelers free guide to better coverage to stay prepared. is your auto and home insurance keeping up with you? contact your local travelers agent, or call 800-my-coverage. welcome back to "morning joe." a live look at the white house. a beautiful day. joining us now former white house press secretary and obama campaign adviser robert gibbs. and nbc's tom brokaw, who is the author of the time of our lives,
a conversation about america. thank you both for being here this morning. >> tom, you have been all over this country, all over this country on a book tour, also just getting out and what are you hearing about this republican field that we've been talking about around the table over the past few weeks? >> it's been interesting. literally i've been in every quadrant of the country in the last several weeks, southeast northwest -- and the issues i write about in "the time of our lives" generate a fair amount of tension about how do we reform education, prepare the next generation with the skill set with which they can compete in the global economy. flat line when it comes to the candidates. there is just no buzz. i met every kind of audience you can possibly imagine. >> you've been covering national elections since what, '68? >> well, since '68 and doing this since -- i'm sorry to say -- 1962. >> you have been across the country. >> right. >> every year. and whether you agreed with the
candidates or didn't like them, didn't like -- there was always excitement for republicans and democrats' fields but this year you say it's different than any election you've seen. >> well, you don't have anybody coming up to me and saying, gee, i'm a romney guy and i don't think he's getting fair treatment. i always knew that newt would pull this out in some fashion and make a comeback. i don't hear any of that. everybody is looking inward more than outward. they're just trying to hold their family, their business, their community together in some fashion. in your home state of alabama, you know, there is a big issue with immigration and what they're going to do about attracting jobs. that was much more of a buzz going on within the state than looking outside the state to see where the national leadership is. >> my home state is florida. i did go to school though in the university of alabama. >> yes you did. >> which by the way i don't know if robert gibbs knows this or not but they're playing for a national championship. >> they are. >> from the mother lode, the minor league baseball team in montgomery, alabama known as the biscuits.
>> i love that. >> they insisted i present that to joe on this program which i'm happy to do. we'll get two box seats the entire season. >> i love this. robert gibbs and i will both say for the montgomery biscuits, roll tide and war eagle. >> there you go. robert gibbs -- >> by the way, robert is excited about this republican field. >> well, i have a little quiz for him just to help sort of exemplify that. what do you look forward to most -- the donald trump debate or the next headline saying, newt might have closed in on this? >> oh, i got to tell you, mika, cancel christmas, just get ready for the donald trump debate. >> why is that? >> pay-per-view. pay-per-view. we ought to -- this is -- the new rule, i think you've heard, you have to have your birth certificate to participate in the debate. and it's like shooting fish in a barrel. >> too easy. >> i've never seen so many people fall over a guy who fox's own poll showed that if you got his endorsement, 5% of the
people would be more in favor of you and 30% of the people would be less in favor of you. i think it is an extension of the republican -- >> what is happening with newt gingrich right now? why is he moving to the front of that field? you're a political guy. what is going on? >> i think, honestly, look. he has done very well in these debates. he is very glib. i think he's done it in a way that's interesting. he's done it in a way not by trying to tear any one or two people down but by trying just to distinguish himself in these debates. this is a very different process than the one we went through four years ago. we spent i think 75 days in iowa in 2007. we were doing five and six, seven events a day, town hall meetings, building an infrastructure. these guys have, because of 17 nationally televised debates, that's how you've built an army in this campaign. i think that newt's done
obviously exceedingly well in those debates and, look. i think -- you don't need four polls in iowa to tell you that he's winning. and i think it's very, very real. i think the romney campaign has probably made some real fundamental strategic mistakes about not playing in iowa a lot earlier. >> you said -- >> the other thing is, joe, he is a -- it was newt gingrich who took over congress in 1984 and was one of the founding members and founding fathers of the way that we are still seeing playing out right now. he has long-time name and figure familiarity with a lot of the voters out there and as bob said, he has articulated very well what a lot of people feel and his attacks on the media have been brilliant because people are constantly looking for a chance to get back at what we do. i'm not picking on "time" magazine or our friend rick stengel. this is how quickly things change. this is september, the rise of
rick perry. right? >> right. >> here is the spring. who is way down here with a question mark? newt gingrich. i mean, off the charts. so that's how fluid and how rapidly this whole thing has changed. >> luckily, both those accurate at the time. >> right. at the time. >> rick perry's i don't think was accurate by the time it was time to change issues because i think if you're a candidate if your best day is the day before you announce, that's not a good thing. i think there clearly is some great impediment between mitt romney and republican primary voters. i think there is a trust issue. they understand that he has been on both sides of many issues for a very long time. they understand that that is who he is. and he has tried to run away from that in many instances in this campaign. and i don't think he's done a very good job of that. >> i want to ask robert gibbs --
mark, perhaps you could analyze. who is better news for president obama at this time of crisis for this country but who leaves more of an open door, newt gingrich or mitt romney? >> check robert's poker face. i think newt gingrich would be very well -- i think -- they seem to be going after him. >> several months off next year. >> i've taken several off. several more. >> i know. you talked to people around gingrich and they'll make the argument he would be stronger, rally the conservative base and doesn't have some of the problems romney has but the republican establishment would be split i think the danger for robert and his boss is if gingrich is the nominee i think there will be a strong centrist third party. >> let's just say there is always the assumption, tom, that a third-party candidate would hurt the republican party. if that third-party candidate is bloomberg, who supports gun control, is pro choice, pro gay marriage, a bloomberg candidacy
spending $2 billion could actually take votes away in swing state is not from the republican but actually from president obama. >> yeah. the independent mass that is always the movable piece have you to pay attention to could gravitate toward him on a lot of those issues while newt could hang on to, if it's newt or even if it's romney the republicans. whatever else they think about their candidates are just so determined to get rid of barack obama in the cycle and get the white house back because they know that is the great engine that drives the big political decision making. that they may, if it's romney, they may be reluctant but they'll stay with him. on the other hand if you do have a third-party candidate, mike bloomberg or somebody else, i think the other one you have to watch is if rand paul comes out as a third-party candidate that could change that equation. >> and then that draws from republicans. >> look, leaving my barack obama or any other or anything else out, from a purely
professional stand point, we always have this election where we start talking about a 30 party candidate. we have seen a bunch of names. in the end most voters understand the next president of the united states is the democratic or republican nominee. you may see polls at any point that said 15 or 18 or 12% support an independent. when push comes to shove and we vote and people get a chance to understand that person is not likely to be the next president, they will vote for someone who is. >> you take nader in florida when al gore was trying to win. >> i think that's the best case for the fact that most voters that support barack obama and the democratic party are not going anywhere. there were 90,000 people that
flirted with the notion of i will acceptsend a message. we got iraq and tax cuts and budget deficits. that was a great academic exercise that ended in years we are trying to recover from. >> bill clinton won the vote and there independent candidates to make a difference. >> i think in the end, it's less likely. >> before you go, i heard this narrative and seen it myself on this street in georgetown. a woman said i'm not come fortable with the direction of this country, but i'm a democrat voting republican this time around. how are you getting back the young people who propelled this president. >> when there is a nominee, people will focus on who the choices are. this is an election about not in
theory as i was talking about, but what you will get in each of the different candidates. what tom wrote about is the simple and defining issue of this time. are we going to have greater opportunity and have job where is we get raises and get more wages as the companies do well? that's the defining issue of our time. when push comes to show of, barack obama has a far better plan to move middle class security forward than any other republican. >> i just have to follow-up. what a year. this is almost like this is the first time cam newton was paid to play football. >> the one thing you understand is that he's humble and an alabama fan, they are not in the
same era. >> we'll be right back. more tom brocaw straight ahead. [ male announcer ] humana and walmart have teamed up to bring you a low-priced medicare prescription drug plan. ♪ with the lowest national plan premium... ♪ ...and copays as low as one dollar... ♪ ...saving on medicare prescriptions is easy. ♪ so you're free to focus on the things that really matter. call humana at 1-800-808-4003. or go to walmart.com for details. the new spark card from capital one. spark miles gives me the most rewards of any small business credit card. the spark card earns double miles... so we really had to up our game. with spark, the boss earns double miles on every purchase, every day. that's setting the bar pretty high. owning my own business has never been more rewarding. coming through! [ male announcer ] introducing spark
1,000. birmingham, alabama 1,000 there. people are really responding. >> they are responding to the idea that they want to have a kind of reasonable dialogue about what's going on. i'm an umpire called balls and strikes. i'm trying to lay out the issues that are not getting enough attention in my judgment about where we go in the future and how to position ourselves with the challenges of the 21st century. one of the key things. you think my children will have the lives they have and i will not. let's make it a qualitative answer and how we get more economic justice and improve education so everyone gets on the playing field. how do we reenlist citizens? >> you are going to south dakota this weekend. >> my mother died five days
short of her 94th birthday. survivor of world war i and world war ii and the depression and she was grandma jane to her great granddaughters and granddaughters. she wanted to be a journalist, but college cost $100 a year so she lived her life through me and had the best ear of anyone i talked to. always knew what was going on intuitively. i describe her as the best managing editor i knew. she came home every night with a different observation about something or somebody that had gone on. we will miss her a lot, but she said a year ago i had a great life, i'm prepared. it's a great thing. >> we will be thinking about you and your family. thank you for sharing.
>> republican presidential congresswoman michele bachmann will join the set. back in a moment. ♪ i'm burning out this useless telephone ♪ ♪ my hair is gone ♪ cheap cologne ♪ motor home ♪ i'm the rocket man! [ both ] ♪ rocket man ♪ burning out his fuse up here alone ♪ burning out his fuse up here alone? ahh. [ male announcer ] crystal clear fender premium audio. one of many premium features available on the all-new volkswagen passat.
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shrink government and the regulation that strangle or business. throughout the tax code and a place with one that is simple and fair. >> you want big cuts? ron paul has been screaming it for years. got $1 trillion? trillion with a t. interior, energy, hud, commerce, gone. later, bureaucrats. that's how ron paul rolls. want to trade the swamp? ron paul. do it. >> good morning. it's 8:00 on the east coast as you take a live look at new york city. we have ron hal person. >> first with newt. >> we have a lot of newt coverage and i'm going to stay
objective. >> what about -- >> were they able to get a friend from boston. >> denis leary it sound like. >> it was a chevy-type ad. >> i don't think he rolls by definition. that's the way ron paul rolls. i don't think ron paul rolls. >> one of the most backhanded compliments. >> you have to read to the end to get the swift. it's like a sake story. >> you get 90% through and this is an endorsement? >> he's a mess and we attack him, but the bottom line is for a year, balanced budget and welfare reform. that's why people who don't know newt, conservatives who don't
know him like him. >> that explains the polls we are seeing. they are ramping up in iowa as new polling shows the former house speaker with a sizable lead in the state with less than a month to go before voting. >> holy cow. are you serious? wow! >> they show gingrich with 33% support with likely republican and caucus goers, 15% in front of mitt romney and ron paul. >> let's just soak these numbers in. by the way, we are talking michele bachmann later. >> the rise, you all touched on these points over the last few days.
he has been around for so long, that a lot of the negatives are out there and the narrative is established and people in the republican party are anxious for a real conservative who will stand up to obama and democrats. he is ambidextrous. he has a record. he has been a part of balancing budgets and welfare reform and making a strong case about seven or eight changes and he was able to deliver on some of them in the eyes of voters. >> what is fascinating about gingrich is, you look at his voting record and his conservative is not as high as mine, but few people's are. 95%. >> you look at that and what
happened when he wasn't in charge of congress. his life has been a train wreck, politically he has been a train wreck. the words that had come from his mouth, the things he has done would have droied him and any other candidate any other year but 2012. this weak field, it is producing the possibility of a newt gingrich nomination. >> he was in new york yesterday and i saw him in the middle of the day, he is extraordinarily confident right now. every nominee of both parties faced an existential scare that looks like you are dead. romney looks like he might get through the nomination, but he is facing it now. >> that's why the obama reelection team is taking note not only of romney, but the
chief campaign adviser. they took a jab at the republican contender's latest ad. >> i was amused bite newt gingrich ad because he talked about bringing the country together. you talk about the godfather of gridlock and the guy who invented the tactics who have become common place. this was a whole new newt. >> the obama case against newt. it may be the public's case against him. people don't want to go back to that. >> go back to what? you have to remember that was 20 years ago. >> the thing is if you ask republicans do you want to go back to a time where against all odds and again, i am not supporting newt or going to vote for newt and support him in any way. if you have been watching my show and think there is any ambiguity there, you are not the
sharpest tool in the shed, that said, if i were a republican and i don't know just how erratic and undisciplined newt gingrich is and what a danger you would be, i would think. here is a guy -- look at south carolina. here is a guy, newt gingrich, who facedown bill clinton in 1994, came in and gave republicans a first majority in a generation. this was a couple of years before you ran. everybody was making fun of gingrich in 93 and 94. i went to washington and they went in and we said think majority. the republican's republican. believing if republicans would just get in, everything would be fine. i laughed. i said if we cut it in half, that would be great.
gingrich master minded a take over and would balance the budget within three years and balance the budget for a first time in a generation. four years for the sirte time since the 1920s. passed welfare reform. everyone now said it's because of bill clinton. >> he played a role. >> but i'm saying newt gingrich dragged him to the table. >> it wouldn't have happened. >> this is important for people to understand today. that bill clinton because his base told him to vetoed welfare reform twice. hopefully he will veto it times and a tenth he will have to be there. yes, the government was shot down and it dragged him to the
table and the budget was passed. voter who is had not seen the train wreck. i'm going to vote for him instead of mitt romney. >> george w. bush was president and had a republican congress. it's very hard to belittle and minimize the importance. i don't disagree. >> i'm not belittling it, but the reality is -- >> bill clinton vetoed. >> he put a coalition of republicans and democrats together. the model should be mimicked. >> we have seen the same bill three times. >> and on the balanced budget, he did not top the do it. >> did you have enough to shut
the government down? >> yeah and they balanced the budget. >> democrats got their concessions. >> that's all we care about. i want to say after trashing gingrich for a month, i am trying to explain why conservatives say this guy did something. while you were there and not only did they do something, he did something historic and hadn't been done in 40 years. it was ugly and i didn't like newt when i was doing it. >> they voted him out. he could become the president. he could. he has a new wife and he's converted to catholicism and he's a grandfather. do you hold open the possibility that he could be a changed man?
>> i'm going to answer that because no. i wrote a column about him and it was about newt was saying. he's a nice lady. he said the democratic party is a socialist secular machine. he called the cvo a socialist scheme to take down america. he is not a nice human being. he is a bad person when it comes to demonizing opponents. he would have made a marvelous marxist because he dehumanizes anyone who gets in his way. >> i have a question for you. >> sorry that fair? i'm not talking about the conclusions. over the past six months, he said horrific things about
people with families, with children. when he puts on his political helmet, he is say terrible person. he dehumanizes people like glen beck, calling them racist and bigots and marxists and socialists. >> i'm not willing to say he's a bad person. >> he may be nice at home. >> his politics. he has a demonization component. >> he is nasty. >> he talks about unifying the country. he's a strange man. >> you are wasting time debating that. if you don't see it, i can't help you. >> people that don't know newt at home need to know this. you sit here and breathe this and live this 24 hours a day and i have known him for 20 years. a lot of people don't. we are trying to be fair here.
yes. newt is a bad person. he dehumanizes people, but i'm also explaining why conservatives, if you are conservative and you look at republicans that don't shoot straight, 20 years ago he made a revolution to balance the budget. >> it tells you where the primary voters are. they want to hear a fighter. they are left limp and newt gingrich is going out every day and houpding president obama. >> they had the national conversation and the republican party is there within a month of telling the party these are the two choices. >> they need to have ray national conversation. >> is any republican endorsed newt gingrich. i was told it has not taken place. he is looking at 94. >> i will tell you, my
conservative friends, the 15 or so of us that pushed newt -- i talked about pushing clinton. we had to push newt because he wanted to cave in. those of us who said if you don't fight for the balanced budget and the tax cuts and the cuts in committee chairmanships, we promised we were going to do it and we will kick you out. those 10 or 15 or so. running again in arizona. all of them. they may not say it publicly, but privately they send the e-mails going what? how many times does newt have to teach these people he's bad for the conservative movement. i don't believe this. there was something in politico who said people were holding the fire against newt because they
were thinking they might have to make peace with him. let me tell you something. the republican establishment will never make peace with newt gingrich. they just won't. this is an important point because the republicans i talked to say he cannot win the nomination at any cost. we will destroy our party and reelect barack obama and will be ruined. that's going to happen. >> that was the question i was trying to ask about five minutes ago before i was trying to get to the donald trump story. which could beat obama. mitt romney or newt gingrich. whether or not americans want to look back at the train wreck of political history or be pragmatic and figure out who can win? >> i think at this point there a lost smart people and people with a lot of money that are saying how do we open this back
up? the choice between mitt romney and newt gingrich for the people that run the republican party is not good enough. we are hearing people going back going how do we broker a convention? i'm sure you are hearing the same thing. we have to have another bite of the apple. this is not wishful thinking. republicans are saying right now this cannot happen. he will destroy the party. >> the question is people will speak out against gingrich. i'm not sure it will hurt him in the next month. >> can i say one thing? i don't know newt gingrich personally. a lot of people who blog about what we say. when i said newt gingrich was a bad person, i thought i was clear. his political character when he
puts on that helmet, he becomes a very bad actor. like a football player may be great off the field and may be bad and a wonderful husband and sometimes puts on a helmet and do cheap shots. that's what i'm talking about. when they call good people like the secretary who i may disagree politically, but she has given her life when he compares her to joseph stalin who killed 30 million people and when that's the norm, it's not a nice person. >> you made that clear, but people will take advantage of it anyway so get ready. >> i want the people to watch to know. i don't know him personally and kind of like it that way. >> when we california back, michele bachmann joins the table. first a check on the forecast.
bill? >> good morning. minor airport delays in the east with fog and light rain. the only big airport reporting delays is philadelphia. call ahead. they are reporting two hours. not so much rain at the big airports, but the green is light rain up the new england coastline. forecast is very warm. enjoy it from new england down to the mid-atlantic. this is the last warm day for a very long time. all the cold air in the middle of the country. look at denver. kansas city at 6. that slides to the east coast and maybe get snow on the back side on the east coast. it's not pretty, but it is warm. new york city at the top of the rock. approved by starbucks. the employee of the month is...
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>> we have to be better and dance backwards in high heels. welcome to "morning joe." you are talking about women. you get up earlier and have to be better. >> and we are and we do. joining us now congressman from minnesota and candidate michele bachmann. she is the author of core of conviction. great to have you on the show. >> talk about the book,
congresswoman. why did you write it? >> it's my life story and who i am. i came from a middle class family and we went to below poverty isy and when i was 12 i had to embrace the responsibilities of life. my mom couldn't even afford my glasses. i got baby-sitting jobs and it was a wonderful teaching experience for me and i put myself through college and when we got older e we didn't forget kids. we raised 23 foster children and launched them into the world and started a charter school for at-risk kids. >> talk about your mom and how hard it was to raise you and -- >> it was tough because she was a life lock home maker and she had to figure out how to make it work. we lost our home and almost
everything in it. i will never forget when she set card tables up in the driveway with her wedding gifts and a lot of women necessary that situation right now. a lot of people are dealing with foreclosures. it is truly a hard time and especially for women. when a woman loses her nest and home, her kids are put at risk. it's a tough time. >> let's talk politics. what openings do you see coming up for yourself. you have the front-runners, mitt romney and newt gingrich. >> they are the consummate insiders. if you want poster children for insiders in washington, d.c., you can't get more. >> newt said he's an outsider. >> interesting. $100 million. his offices are on the rodeo
drive of washington, d.c., k street. he has been the consummate insider. i think that's where i stand out. in my book people see clearly that i am the consistent conservative. i'm 55 years old. i have been a real person my whole life. that's what the tea partiers are looking for. who is the real deal and authentic? i am not come lately. i have a lifetime. if you look at newt gingrich or mitt romney, they have put in place the obama care and the bailout and have been on board with working for freddie mac for instance and newt gingrich's case. making a lot of money. >> i would agree about the two front-runners. why are they doing so well and why isn't your message resonate something. >> two weeks ago people would
think herman cain was the next president or rick perry was the next president. as they look at the candidates they make their decision. 30 days is an eternity in this race. political wall street. we are positioned to be able to win. people will see i am the real deal. that's what tea partiers are looking for. who will mean what they say and say what they mean. an outsider has been a fighter in washington. >> i own this show and my politico columns and the inconsistencies of newt. a guy i have known and worked for since 1994. it's hard for me to figure out what drives me the craziest. whether it was him being the champion of the $7 trillion medicare scheme or going paul ryan social engineer a radical
and getting paid $1.6 million to prop up an institution that destroyed this economy. i have a top 10 or top 20 list. let me ask you what has newt done that proves he is not a conservative? >> the fact that he has been on the take for over $100 million, washington should tell people about the fact that he is no outsider. what you are seeing is an ability that he has to be able to project himself as a conservative. the same as mitt romney. these guys had been the standard bearer for the movement in the republican party. they are the great pretenders and frugal socialists. they won't get it in either mitt romney or newt gingrich and i have been the who has been at the tip of the spear fighting on the issues. whether you agree with them or
not. i brought 40,000 americans to fight against obama care. i fought against the dodd-frank bill. i wrote the legislation to repeal obama care. who is going to go in and repeal obama care? mitt romney who put it into place in massachusetts? newt gingrich who had the idea for it and wants to mandate that everyone buy the insurance or me who brought the people to fight it? >> by the way to put meat on the bones, newt gingrich in 1993 supported mark halpern. a lot of conservatives like me are hoping they overturn next year. >> you have been outspoken here about the lack of conservatives.
can we expect you to carry that in the debates? >> that's a hall mark. i say what i mean and mean what i say. there will be no deviation. we have to stand for our positions. >> do you expect a big turn out in the caucuses. you have a party that wants to beat president obama and you talked to tom brocaw, there is no engagement that we have seen. we look for the big turn out. >> you will see at least as consistent with priest years, there is a pent up desire to make sure that barack obama is a one-term president. the number of undecided is 70%. people will make up their mind in the last week. >> let me ask you about the issue of the week in congress. it says a lot about the
differences and the contrast in people like you. the argument from the white house and i would be interested to get your take. republicans are for tax cuts unless they are for little class workers. they are against a 3% sur tax on people who make a million or more. protecting the wealthy and not the middle class. what do you say to that? >> a year ago we had the same debate about cutting the payroll tax. i was against it a year ago. i will tell you the reason why. it would blow a hole in the social security trust fund. we deent that. i opposed it last year and we did blow the hole in the trust fund and it's running in the red. we have to go to the general treasure to get money to send out checks to senior citizens. i oppose that tax cut and president obama said it would create jobs. there is not a shred of evidence
that that created jobs. his premises was wrong, but also it's hurting senior citizens. i won't do that. >> you don't think it is stimulative enough. >> thank you for saying that because that's also another reason to oppose it. it wasn't stillilative. the president believed it would be. if it did, it would be a reason to support it. it didn't. we need job creation. i was so adamant against obama care, it's the number one job killer in the country according to small business. >> beyond the health care law, what's the best idea for creating laws? >> i'm a former tax litigation attorney and one of the only ones in congress and running for presidency. i want to a polish the tax code and put in place a lower rate on businesses and individuals, but i want to make sure people who
are wealthy pay at least as much as the middle class, but what sets my plan apart, i want everyone to pay something. even if you come from the lower income, you all benefit from this. people should pay at least $10 a year. it changes your mind set if you are not participating. >> let me ask you about incomes. the disparity that we are seeing makes us stand out in a way we don't like. how important is fixing that in your agenda long-term in terms of trying to overcome the lack of mobility on the middle to lower classes. you can understand the protesters out there. this disparity is ruining our future. >> i understand the frustration that people have because i came out of poverty and i had to work my way out of it. it's by having jobs. we have a real problem with
unemployment, particularly among youth and particularly among african-american and hispanic youth. they need a leg up. we saw it. they needed a good education and they needed an ability to have entry level jobs. the best thing to do is focus job creation. we are not seeing that. for 34 months we haven't seen an increase until this last week in a jobs report. part of that is a lot of people fell off unemployment. >> would you agree to warren buffett should not pay's lower tax rate than his secretary. it's outrageous. how will you make it so the largest corporations in the world don't pay less in taxes than your foster kids that go out into the workforce. that's outrageous whether you are a democrat, conservative, or
liberal. >> one thing is to make sure that ge pays as much as google or another company. ge only had an effective tax rate of 7% this last year. google's was 21%. if you look at marathon oil, they had a 49% tax rate. why are the corporations paying such different rates? they have sweetheart deals carved out for them. i want to a polish them and have a level playing field. >> deals created by people who get paid $100 million in washington? >> when they cash in on it? >> isn't that funny. you heard this a million times in washington. let me tell you something. all i want is a definitely playing field. they want you to go into the --
they all say the same thing. the lobbyists in washington explained this. lobbyists on k street for the most part are not asking for money. they are asking for tax breaks. to carve up the code and make it more convoluted. >> have the government rub out competitors. the tax code is 3.8 million words and the reason why is because it's carve outs and sweet heard deals. that's what they do. that is the playground. >> i get sick and tired of people saying whether i'm a republican or a democrat, i believe in the market. there is no free market when you have crony capitalism. >> if you want to talk about a poster child for that, it's newt gingrich as the consummate influence peddler, but mitt romney is cut out of the same cloth. he has been a washington, d.c.
insider. the tea party movement is looking for someone who is a fighter and stand up for them and their values. >> he never worked in washington. how is he a washington insider. he was acting in that same form. >> house keeping before you go. is there a scenario in which you would vote for a millionaire who keeps small businesses out of the loop? >> no. i would not. if you look historically at the data it has led to less job creation than more and drove people out of the state of new jersey when they did it there. >> will you take part in the donald trump debate? >> good question. i think only one accepted so far which is newt gingrich.
i like donald trump. we haven't made the decision. we are trying to figure it out. we may. >> michele bachmann, let me say we have said tough things about you on this show, but a week or two ago, we reached out to you after jimmy fallon. we thought you were great. >> and i'm here. >> and you are here and we really think that this race is wide open. 30 days until iowa. four weeks from today. you think you have a shot? >> more than a shot. i am excited to be there. we will be there this week. thank you. merry christmas to all of you. >> the book is core of conviction. we will be watching in iowa. >> thank you. >> we shall return in a moment.
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dropped 29% in years and expected to drop another 50% in the next ten. they are raising the cost of a first class stamp boy a penny in january and looking at closing 3700 post offices and looking to shut down half of the mail processing centers and eliminate 28,000 jobs. it is asking congress for permission to cancel saturday delivery. the question is whether a day matters. >> everything is on the internet. it has lost a lot of elements in my life. >> i have a business and send mail and because of my timelines it would be easier if the mail stayed on the schedule that it's on now. >> in the grand scheme of things a day is not a big deal. if it keeps the post office afloat and keeps us having a post office, i can live with that. >> no one expects it to go away,
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it's part of the point. the futures are flat. nicholas sarkozy was up 150 and sandard and poor's said there is a 50% chance we may downgrade. i want to share a quick statement. systemic stresses have risen to the extent that they put downward pressure on the credit standing as a whole. the collective experts' response is no duh. why did s&p come out now on this? they focus on friday and that big eu summit and they are trying to get u.s.'s two sends in. europe headlines are driving the market right now. >> no duh. it's a term of art that you learn. >> it is. thanks a lot. >> the best of late night is
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good morning and welcome to "morning joe." it's 6:00 on the east coast. . >> i learned two things. michele bachmann has four weeks to go. a time in politics. >> i was with you on that one. it's not going to happen. >> michele bachmann pledges to go after mitt romney and newt gingrich for being insiders. >> that's confessing. >> and also, we learned that she has not committed yet to the donald trump debate. >> we are waiting to see. joe and i will be there. in the book event. >> you are not going to want to miss it. it's way too early. >> it is "morning joe." see you back here tomorrow. st